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Buying an old house

07/05/1999 02:08 AM

We are considering buying an old (60-100 years) house. Ideally, we want one that is already resored, or one we can have professionals finish out for us (I just don't have the time to do the stuff I know how too, and a lot of stuff on that old of a house would be beyond my abilities!.

What I'm looking for is a "checklist" or articles/web pages about what to look for. What can we miss that will turn the dream house into a house of horrors? Our current house is almost 30 years old and both we and the "professional" building inspector missed some MAJOR problems. I'd like to avoid that this time.

Any suggestions?

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Buying an old house

07/06/1999 08:54 AM

I have a 110 year old house and I've run across some ofthe strangest things about it. Here are some of the things you'll want to look for. 1) Termite damage - if possible check the subfloor especially near the outside walls and the outside walls themselves near gutters and roof line 2) Check wood gutter if they are part of house, see if they are functional 3) WIRING is a biggie, older houses can be partially updated with old mixed with new and will not likely be up to code 4)Plumbing is another one. Check for leaks and old pipes. My house has some CLAY pipes is spots (ouch!) that I replaced asap. Hope this helps and check out oldhousejournal.com

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Buying an old house

07/07/1999 05:14 PM

While doing many masonry restorations on older houses we find that stone foundations tend to be very leaky and waterproofing can be expensive if done right. The biggest problem in renovating an older house is (wires and pipes would always need to be brought up to code if you start renovations) structural menbers (columns, walls, floors) are alwayd sagging, out of plumb square level , etc.)The last house we were involved in renovating had $85,000 in extras because the existing members did not meet current code and they must and there is never sufficient bearing on older homes. No one can price waht is unseen and uforseen items are always very expensive and always and extra.

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Buying an old house

07/18/1999 02:05 PM

Our house is 100 years old wiring and plumbing and wiring is the two main problems we have run into (outside of normal upkeep). Money spent on having an electrician inspect the wiring will be money well spent, if only for your peace of mind. If the wiring is not up to code, you could possibly have the current owner do that for you as a precondition to buying. We knew that our own service was insufficient, but until it was closely inspected we didn't know how unsafe it was.

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Buying an old house

03/30/2002 02:55 PM AHJ

4-3 Electrical Installations.
4-3.1 Violations and Hazards.
Problems in electrical installations and equipment are generally associated with several types of violations or with misunderstandings of the items" design features. A great deal of technical knowledge is required for recognition of improper design features. Hazards might be hidden from view by the building’s configuration. However, certain telltale signs of problem areas are recognizable to the trained fire fighter.
4-3.2 Overcurrent Protection.
4-3.2.1
The commonly used overcurrent protection devices for the protection of feeders, circuits, and equipment are fuses, circuit breakers, and thermal overload units. Basically, the purpose of the fuse, circuit breaker, or fuse cartridge is the same: to open the circuit if the electrical current reaches a value that will cause an excessive or dangerous temperature in the conductor, a condition becoming more common with the increasing numbers of electrical appliances now in use. This safety feature is negated when a fuse or circuit breaker of a higher rated capacity is used to replace one of a lower rating (for example, replacing a 15-amp fuse with a 30-amp fuse) or by bridging the circuit by placing a conductor behind the fuse.
It can be difficult to determine such overloading unless fire fighters know the gauge of the wire used in the circuit and the electrical devices it feeds. Normally, the only way to determine improper overloading is to remove the fuse and examine it for excessive heating at the fuse base. It should also be checked for the presence of metallic bridging. Overheating can also be the result of a loose fuseholder, or the fuse might be shorted. Residents should be requested to label branch circuits in the space provided on the panel box door.
4-3.2.2
Plug fuses consist of two basic types: the ordinary Edison-base type and the S type. Either could be a time-delay type. Edison-type fuses are designed for ease of replacement and will account for most problems. The Edison-base fuseholder will take an Edison-base fuse of any size up to the maximum 30-amp rating. Where 30-amp fuses are discovered in branch-circuit panelboards, the occupant should be cautioned that these circuits might not be designed for this ampere service.
Adapters can be installed in Edison-base fuseholders that will prevent using higher rated S-type fuses in the adapter designed for lower ratings. Adapters also prevent the use of pennies or other common bridging devices.
4-3.2.3
Cartridge fuses are provided in two types: the one-time type and the renewable link type. Cartridge fuseholders are designed to prevent, or to make extremely difficult, inserting a fuse other than the type for which the fuseholder was designed. Renewable link cartridge fuses have the following disadvantages:
(1) The links can be doubled or tripled, thereby defeating their purpose and usefulness.
(2) The links, upon replacement, can be left with loose connections.
4-3.2.4
Circuit breaker overloading will be more difficult to determine without tracing the circuit that it protects. Explaining the design features of fusing to the occupant may be the best way to determine an unintentional violation. Any difference in the physical appearance between circuit breakers in a panel could be an indication of circuit overloading and is worthy of further investigation by a qualified electrician.
4-3.2.5
Ground-fault circuit interrupters (GFCIs) are devices that sense when current, even a small amount, passes to ground through any path other than the proper conductor. When this situation occurs, the GFCI trips almost instantly, stopping the flow of current in the circuit and through the person receiving the ground-fault shock. NFPA 70, National Electrical Code®, requires GFCI protection on all 135-V, single-phase, 15- and 20-amp receptacle outlets installed outdoors where there is direct grade level access to the dwelling unit and to the receptacles. GFCI protection is also required for 125-V, single-phase, 15- and 20-amp receptacles installed in garages, in crawl spaces at or below grade level, in unfinished basements, within 6 ft (2 m) of a kitchen sink where receptacles serve countertop surfaces, and in bathrooms. Receptacles located within 20 ft (6 m) of the inside walls of a permanently installed pool, fountain, or similar location must also be protected by a ground-fault circuit interrupter.
If GFCIs are found in the course of an inspection, the occupant should be requested to operate the test button on the unit to determine whether it is operating correctly. If so, the reset button will pop out and the circuit will open. It is returned to normal mode by depressing the reset button. If non-GFCI protected receptacles are found near sinks or outdoors, the occupant should be advised of the safety advantages to be gained by replacing them with GFCI-type receptacles.
4-3.3 Grounded Receptacles.
NFPA 70, National Electrical Code, requires all electric service to be grounded. Receptacles installed on 15- and 20-amp branch circuits are required to be of the grounded type and should be effectively grounded. Testing meters that, when inserted into receptacles, indicate proper grounding of the receptacle are available. Local electrical inspectors can be very helpful in explaining local codes in fire department training sessions.
Even though older dwellings might not have grounded receptacles, major appliances, such as dishwashers, dryers, washing machines, and garbage disposals, should be grounded externally or special grounded branch circuits should be provided for them. The surveyor should be especially alert for the use of three-pronged plugs whose grounding prong has been removed or on which adapters have been attached to mate with two-prong polarized outlets. Such practices can give rise to a shock hazard for users of such appliances, and the occupant should be so advised.
4-3.4 Outdoor Electrical Service.
Electrical main service coming into the dwelling should be inspected. Cables that are too close to trees, swimming pools, spas, saunas, antennas, or to downspouts, gutters, or cables not securely attached to the building, could present a life or fire hazard. Outdoor antennas should not be attached to any electric service raceway or service mast. Live vegetation such as trees should not be used for the support of outside overhead conductors. Underground branch circuits are permitted to be used for this supply to outdoor lighting fixtures and associated electrical equipment on trees.
4-3.5 Other Common Electrical Hazards Found in the Home.
4-3.5.1
Heat buildup occurs in wiring when resistance to electrical current flow is experienced. Loose wire nuts or cable connections (especially in aluminum wiring), wiring run through doorways or under carpeting, and furniture or other heavy objects resting on wires can produce this condition.
4-3.5.2
Unusual wear to insulation on wiring can result from cables not properly secured, objects hanging on cables, or, as described in 4-3.5.1, wiring run through doorways or under carpeting.
4-3.5.3
Dirty, poorly maintained electric motors or missing covers on junction boxes can eventually result in a short circuit or in a fire. All unused openings (knockouts) in boxes and cabinets (panel boards) should be properly closed.
4-3.5.4
Extension cords (even though UL listed) can be too small for certain electrical loads, such as irons and air conditioners. Extension cords should never be used for permanent connections; they should be used only temporarily. If fire fighters are to provide worthwhile guidance to the occupant, they should be trained to match the current-carrying capability of the extension cord with the current demand of the electrical loads connected to it.
4-3.5.5
“Octopus” fittings allow excessive electrical devices to be connected to one outlet, causing excessive current flow with resultant heat buildup. Power strips with integral overcurrent protection should be recommended to replace octopus fittings.
4-3.5.6
Insulation that is frayed is unsafe, and its breakdown could be imminent. Fraying is often a problem, especially on powered hand tools. It should be recommended that such wiring be replaced.
4-3.5.7
To avoid possible ignition should a gas leak occur, electrical outlets or fuse panels should not be located adjacent to gas meters or gas diaphragms.
4-3.5.8
The use of appliances, fixtures, and wiring that are not listed by a testing laboratory should be discouraged.
4-3.5.9
The use of child safety covers should be recommended on all electrical outlets in homes that have young children. Such plugs are intended to cover the receptacle openings so that a child cannot insert a conductive object.
4-3.5.10
Clear spaces should be kept around all electrical panels.
4-3.5.11
Where the surveyor encounters lighting fixtures with halogen bulbs, the occupant should be advised of the hazard presented by the high temperature of such bulbs and the need to keep combustibles well away from them. Many manufacturers of such fixtures have developed guards for installation over bulbs. (Other types of bulbs also can get hot enough to cause fires if they come into contact with light combustible materials such as window curtains.)
4-3.5.12
Most modern television receivers, stereo components, and VCRs have a so-called instant-on feature. These units are energized when plugged into a wall. Occupants should be advised that it is a good practice to unplug such units whenever they are away from home for an extended period of time.

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I have an old house.

03/05/2008 04:39 PM nitroxer

The house I purchased has a mixture of outlets, some polarity and some grounded. It also has a add-on office with conduit running through the roof and across it to the new add-on.

I checked the electrical panel for the add-on and it has Crouse Hinds HACR Type LM ciruit breakers, apparently engineered in the 1990's to hold a current change longer than traditional ciruit breakers.

The house is wired with copper; not aluminum. That's at least one positive thing. The main panel is full and I can't tell what goes to what or if this is a 100 A panel or 150 A.

I'm having an electrican in to advise what to do; but, has anyone ever upgraded one of these houses to current codes? If so, are you aware that code will change this year and do you have any information about the 2008 electrical code?

Scuba Guy (Nitroxer)

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