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bigwind

08:46PM | 02/08/07
Member Since: 02/08/07
11 lifetime posts
Bvelectrical
I have a 30" Sears: Kenmore: Roper drop in range. The repair parts list is good for three models: 45461690 or 911.45565690 or 911.45569690. Don't know where to look for the model numbers but hope questions are answerable the same for all three of these models? If not, tell me and I'll re-post with the exact model tomorrow!

The oven has operated well for varying periods of time but will always quit at some point and display an F3 fault code. If I play with it for a while it will sometimes restart and on at least 2 occasions displayed an F5 code. F5 has never come up first, only after fooling with the thing!?

NOW the oven always quits;displays F3 and will NOT restart for at least an hour or so!

There is no 'Y' in the model number so I'm hoping I'm reading the correct Roper code directory. If so F3 is an Open Sensor or thermal fuse.

1st QUESTION: Am I fairly safe to expect repairing the F3 problem will result in a successful repair OR am I at further risk with the F5 showing up in the past after I fooled with it?

2nd QUESTION: Should I check the thermal fuse first? Where is the thermal fuse located and how do I access it? I can't seem to find it on the diagram? Should I replace it and see if the problem goes away or is it a normal fuse where I either have continuity or I don't? If that is true I assume it must be good because the oven always comes on; doesn't stay on but always comes on?

3rd QUESTION: Is the Sensor I'm looking for located inside the oven cavity in the upper right corner? It looks like a long metal rod protruding into the oven about 5 inches and appears to be held in by two Phillips screws. If I remove the screws does it unplug or how should I remove it? Do I need to unscrew and take the entire Oven Cavity to access where the sensor is attached or do I need to pull the unit out of the counter top? Neither look very easy?

4th Question: How do I test the Sensor? Is there an Ohms parameter that would indicate it is good and if so what is it? Am I correct to assume the sensor is faulty and must be replaced if it is 'Open", no continunity?

Thanks for all the help in advance, bigwind!

DanO

08:42AM | 02/09/07
Member Since: 11/11/02
2274 lifetime posts
** Am I fairly safe to expect repairing the F3 problem will result in a successful repair **

If that's the only problem with it.

** OR am I at further risk with the F5 showing up in the past after I fooled with it? **

That could be a possibility depending on why that error displayed in the first place.

** Should I check the thermal fuse first? **

If it has one, definitely! Not all range models do... in fact it is fairly rare.

** Where is the thermal fuse located **

On models that have one, it is sometimes located under the manifold panel.

** is it a normal fuse where I either have continuity or I don't? **

Yes. AFAIK all "fuses" are that way.

** Is the Sensor I'm looking for located inside the oven cavity in the upper right corner? **

The oven sensor (see the following link) is inside the oven cavity but I have no idea exactly where it is located on your model.

- Kenmore 911.45461690, 911.45565690, 911.45569690 Oven Sensor

LINK > http://www.appliance411.com/data.php?ap=AP2023670

** If I remove the screws does it unplug? **

Yes.

** Do I need to unscrew and take the entire Oven Cavity to access where the sensor is attached or do I need to pull the unit out of the counter top? **

Not usually.

** How do I test the Sensor? **

For resistance. It should read about 1100 ohms when at room temperature.

** Am I correct to assume the sensor is faulty and must be replaced if it is 'Open", no continuity? **

Definitely... although such an extreme failure is rare.

** Don't know where to look for the model number **

You can find tips for locating the model number identification tag on your appliances in the 'Repair Parts' section of my web site linked below.

Dan O.

www.Appliance411.com/parts/?ref411=Kenmore+Range

The Appliance Information Site

=D~~~~~~

bigwind

09:50AM | 02/09/07
Member Since: 02/08/07
11 lifetime posts
Thank you very much for such concise answers. You have helped me greatly!

I am assuming here and deducting from what you said so please correct this statement: If I remove the screws holding the sensor in place, I can simply pull the wire leading away from it and this will cause

the wiring harness into view! I can then unplug the sensor lead?

"Thanks Again" for the excellent help, Bigwind!

DanO

04:18PM | 02/09/07
Member Since: 11/11/02
2274 lifetime posts
Once the sensor mounting screws are removed, the sensor should be able to be pulled into the oven cavity to expose its wiring harness. Many will have a plug in the harness which can then be used to test its resistance.

Dan O.

www.Appliance411.com/parts/?ref411=Kenmore+Range

The Appliance Information Site

=D~~~~~~

bigwind

05:02PM | 02/09/07
Member Since: 02/08/07
11 lifetime posts
I had 1050 ohm's! I assume that's close enough and this then is NOT my problem!

After reading a bit more here's my plan...please critique:

1) Test my sensor leads from the block terminal to ground.

2) Check connector terminals for corrosion, deformation & cold solder.

Is there anything else I should check before throwing in the towel and buying a new control unit?

A final Thanks for your help, Dan! 411 is an excellent site with VERY competitive rates...Bigwind!

DanO

09:41PM | 02/09/07
Member Since: 11/11/02
2274 lifetime posts
** [the sensor] had 1050 ohm's **

Sounds about right.

** Test my sensor leads from the block terminal to ground. **

I don't know what you mean by that. Usually testing the sensor circuit *where it attaches to the electronic control* will usually rule out a problem in the sensor or its wiring harness at the same time.

** Is there anything else I should check **

Not that I can think of.

BTW. Did you ever look up the proper model number for your range?

Dan O.

www.Appliance411.com/parts/?ref411=Kenmore+Range

The Appliance Information Site

=D~~~~~~

richapplyguy

01:26AM | 02/10/07
Member Since: 01/21/07
23 lifetime posts
Did you test the sensor with it unplugged?

Also with your symptoms you still may have a bad sensor that acts up when the oven gets hot.

I would just replace the sensor and see if that fixes it: cheaper than a new control and

it can be returned if not the problem.

Please post results.

bigwind

01:53AM | 02/10/07
Member Since: 02/08/07
11 lifetime posts
Excellent advice. I honestly had not considered it because I thought all electronic parts are not returnable!

Dan O has best price but given your suggestion and time I'll pick one up at sears today, install it and post back tonight.

I'm a Small Engine Tech and we can NOT return anything electrical...if you hadn't said it, I would have never asked about the return policy.

"Thanks" richapplvguy..or is it Rich and Happy Guy...Hope so, Ha! I appreciate your time!

DanO

10:06AM | 02/10/07
Member Since: 11/11/02
2274 lifetime posts
** I would just replace the sensor and see if that fixes it... it can be returned if not the problem. **

That is not usually the case (see the following link) but will depend on the company the part is purchased from.

- Repair Parts: Don't be surprised!

LINK > http://www.appliance411.com/parts/surprise.shtml

It is also not a good way to go about performing service... but in some cases you just don't have any choice with these electronically controlled appliances. :(

JMO

Dan O.

www.Appliance411.com/parts/?ref411=Kenmore+Range

The Appliance Information Site

=D~~~~~~

bigwind

03:13PM | 02/10/07
Member Since: 02/08/07
11 lifetime posts
I have NOT opened the G.E. package with my new sensor in it...YET!

Has an old man screwed up on his meter reading? The Sensor, disconnected from the harness, reads 1.095 @ 2K, 1.09 @ 20K, and 1.0 @ 200K. Do I have 1095 Ohms or is this reading so low that any reasonably well educated human should know the Sensor is BAD?

I then followed the leads from the Sensor up to where it connects to the control unit. With the SEnsor still DISCONNECTED I checked ohm's between the pin and ground. At 20K one pin reads 1, which is open and the other pin reads 5.94 @ 20K. Does this mean anything to you guys.

Thanks again and sorry for such a long thread.
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