COMMUNITY FORUM

jimbo

03:45PM | 02/13/99
Bvelectrical
I am building a 14 x16 barn located about 50ft from my home
I would like to run a 220v service line from my exsisting 200a service in my home.
Whats the best way to go about this procedure. Would prefer to bury cable under ground
Do i need a separate service panel for the barn?

Mike from Homeworks

05:01AM | 02/14/99
Jimbo,

Your would need to install a sub-panel in your barn. If your not familiar with this its best to hire a licensed electrician to help you out. they can size the panel to accomodate your electrical needs.

Mike

Christopher

06:52AM | 02/14/99
Jimbo,
What do you plane to do? Are you going to split up the 220v circuit to feed lights or do you just need an outlet?
If you just need an outlet you just have to know the amperage you are going to require and size the wire accordingly ....
the following is based on your footage requirements anything over 100' you have derate the wire size.
14awg = 15amp
12awg = 20amp
10awg = 30amp

If your going to split up the circuit your going to need a distribution panel (circuit breaker panel)

My suggestion is to did a trench and buried a 3/4" pvc pipe at lest 18" in the ground then bring it into the house above the finish grade (ground level) then bring it into the
panel(s) directly for a professional look keep all your pipes straight and use the necessary sweeps(90's/45's)to make turns. Also remember the NEC (National Electrical Code) doesn't allow more then (4)90degree turns in a single run to reduce stress on the insulation of the wire during the pulling, they something called a "C condulet" (C=continus).
Also the panel in your barn will be considered a subpanel, this subpanel MUST BE GROUNDED so when pulling the wire you MUST pull a GREEN GROUND wire and you MUST install it under it's own ISOLATED GROUNDING BUSS BAR. The panel you will get will/should come with a ground screw that in normal situation (not being a subpanel) that would be screwed through the Neutral buss bar that is all ready there. THIS SCREW MUST NOT BE USED.
Hope this put you on track... Of course not everyone has the same idea of running pipe as I have suggested here but the wiring method is gospel.
If you have any other question or concerns you can always contact me at Lampman5@aol com.

Christopher

06:58AM | 02/14/99
***Also remember the NEC (National Electrical Code) doesn't allow more then (4)90degree turns in a single run to reduce stress on the insulation of the wire during the pulling*

Allow me to rephrase this last statement:
The NEC (National Electrical Code) doesn't allow more 360 degrees in turns in one single run

jimbo

09:03AM | 02/14/99
Thanks Christopher
Sounds like a good plan and good advice.
I would like to split up the 220v line to accomadate one 220 outlet[welder] three standard 110v wall outlets and of coarse lighting.That shouldnt be a problem right?
Should I install an additional grounding rod along wih the groundwire from the main panel outside the barn?
Can the incoming line enter the barn through a poured concrete floor {before its pourred) or through the wall just above grade
Hav so many questions not enough time
Thanks Again

DR HOME

12:36PM | 02/14/99
The wire cannot be sheathed electrical cable type. They must be individual wires. Watch your amperage draw, especially for the welder.

TomR

05:46PM | 02/16/99
I would also suggest that you keep an eye towards the future, and maybe consider installing the necessary components to support a 100-amp sub-panel in your barn. The cost would not be that much more, and would allow for just about anything you may want to do out there.

I recently encountered almost the same situation, except it was a garage, and maybe only 40 feet away. We installed a 100-amp double-pole breaker in the main panel, then ran from there, an underground-rated flexible cable to the garage, about 18” down.

We were required by our code to put a layer of a certain kind of gravel at the bottom of the ditch before the cable was put in. I know that other areas of the country may require conduit. Unfortunately, I can’t remember what size cable we used. Maybe one of the others who are following this post will know the answer. Of course, your municipality will be able to tell you what you need to do, since this project almost certainly will require a permit. We also found that the electric company was the best deal with respect to digging the trench and laying the cable. Ditch digging is not one of my specialties.

In the garage now is a 100-amp, 20-space sub-panel that is basically the same as a main, with 20 places for branch circuits for various machines, receptacles, and lights.

Currently, there is only one 15-amp and one 20 amp circuit hooked up, but I should not have to worry about future needs making me have to do it all over again. Just something for you to think about

friedhaber

05:36AM | 02/17/99
TomR,
I found your post interesting, as I will be doing pretty much the exact same thing (new garage) next summer. I've got a couple of questions for you:
- What exact kind of "flexable underground rated" wire did you use for the run from your house to the garage? I've been planning to use 6-3UF (for 240v 50amps).
- What was that special kind of gravel called?

Thanks!
Ed

Lampman5

01:13PM | 02/17/99
Hello again Jimbo,

This is Christopher, I re registered so people can see my E-mail address.

Jimbo, splitting up for other branch circuits are not a problem, but as Dr. Home mentions, you must be aware of the amperage draw of the welder and all the other receptacles. The guide line I use is 11 receptacles on a 20amp circuit. You have to know the amperage of the load going to be consumed for the proper rating of the subpanel also keep in mind you can't take to much power away from the main panel, don't oversize the barn panel if the house panel is a small one.
NO Jimbo don't install an addition groundrod, all that is taken care of through that green wire and additional grounding buss.
Also as Dr.Home mentioned DO NOT install sheathed electrical cable wire in the pvc pipe you will individual conductors rated for the amperage you will be consuming and have the insulation with the rating of "THHN"
Remember to GROUND EVERYTHING make those 110v utility outlets GFCI protected
You can have the pvc pipe stub up through the poured concrete, it would be ideal if you could position the stub of your pipe in the same bay you plan to install your subpanel
If you any anymore questions and I don't get back here to answer them quick enough just drop me an email at [email protected] and let me know there is another posting and I'll get back here A.S.A.P.
Good luck
Christopher

DR HOME

01:49PM | 02/17/99
Any small rounded gravel without sharp edges. Sand will also pass. I would also check with your local township. They may have regulations over and above what the NEC requires. It would be a shame to have to tear all of your work back up and redo it. It's been done far too many times......
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