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JonathanGennick

02:44PM | 12/04/02
Member Since: 11/02/02
69 lifetime posts
Bvelectrical
I'm encountering some frustrations installing a waterproof fixture in my basement utility shower. Rather than try to explain in words, I put some photos up at http://gennick.com/lamp.html. My questions follow the photos. I think I'm not quite on the right path. I'd really appreciate it if someone else could have a look at the photos and perhaps set me straight on what I'm doing.

[This message has been edited by JonathanGennick (edited December 05, 2002).]

doug seibert

07:33AM | 12/05/02
Member Since: 08/10/02
842 lifetime posts
JG............Well I took a look at the light and the site too.........

The 3-screws need a countersink........a slight recess "drilled" into that wood board ceiling in the 3 places.......Usually the screws would easily pass into the drywall but in your case you have solid wood............Just use an oversized drill to create a small hole at each point......

Caulk the can as it passes thru the boards filling any V-grooves for a dry installation..........

The cork gasket is correct between the can and the lens.............

JonathanGennick

08:17AM | 12/05/02
Member Since: 11/02/02
69 lifetime posts
Ok. Thanks. I appreciate your reply. So I don't need to worry about clearence between the light can and the edges of the boards where the can passes through the ceiling? The instructions were actually very unclear on that point, in one paragraph they seemed to imply that it was ok for the can to touch the ceiling where it passed through, and in another paragraph they seemed to say just the opposite.

What about the fact that the glass plate jiggles around loose when the lamp is screwed shut. Is that really watertight enough? I bet if I took a hose and sprayed it that I could get water inside the lamp where bulb is.

There must be a huge margin for error on how watertight these so-called "waterproof" fixtures need to be.

The instructions that came with this fixture could've been better...

[This message has been edited by JonathanGennick (edited December 05, 2002).]

Electrical Inspector

11:56AM | 12/06/02
Member Since: 09/27/02
73 lifetime posts
Hi Jonathan

quote:
The cork ring that you see in the photo is supposed to seal the bulb area so that water vapor (i.e. steam) doesn't get in, right? Yet even when I tighten all three screws holding the metal ring in place, the glass plate still wiggles enough to easily allow air to pass between the inside and outside of the fixture. The cork seems meaningless in light of the fact that the glass is so loose.

the cork gasket should be sealing this, you should investigate as to what is the obstruction here.....

quote:
The screws that hold the metal ring, cork, and glass to the fixture extend over 1/4 inch into what will be the ceiling. This will prevent me from shoving the fixture up flush against the ceiling, and thus I won't get a good seal, and thus water vapor will easily pass into the ceiling area in behind the fixture where the junction box sits.

i think i'll side with Doug's advice here.
quote:

I've been able to maintain the required 1/2 inch clearence around the fixture, except for where the ceiling itself touches it. Maybe I should carve out the hole in the ceiling enough to clear those screws, which would give me the 1/2 inch I need, but that leaves me with precious little overlap between the ring and the ceiling. Still, maybe that's what I need to do. Opinions?

Is this an IC rated recessed fixture?

quote:

Do I have the cork in the wrong place? Should the cork go up higher, between the fixture and the ceiling, and not between the glass and the fixture?


no, i think you have it right. One more thought here is to have this light served via GFI, it cannot hurt to have the extra protection

JonathanGennick

01:03PM | 12/06/02
Member Since: 11/02/02
69 lifetime posts
I took another look at how this is put together. Begin with the outer trim-ring. In that trim-ring is a recessed area into which the glass fits. Three small, flat, sheet-metal tabs then rotate over the edge of the glass to hold it in place. The cork is next, and the cork overlays the edge between the glass and the trim-ring.

Those three tabs actually seem to be the problem. They hold the cork up off the glass, and they seem to hold the trim-ring just far enough from the can so that even when all the screws are tight I can jiggle the glass a bit. It's not like there's lots of space, but if that plate of glass can jiggle up and down, then there's no seal, right?

The trim ring doesn't fit quite flush with the ceiling either. There's a real small crack, and if I get my head up there I can see light.

Perhaps this is what I get for buying this fixture at my local home center. Where do you think I could go to buy a better one?

BTW, you asked about an IC rating. No, the fixture is not IC rated, but then it's not in contact with any insulation either. The box specifically said it was for showers and other wet areas.

JonathanGennick

01:04PM | 12/06/02
Member Since: 11/02/02
69 lifetime posts
Oh, and all my bathroom lights are on a GFCI breaker, including this one.

Electrical Inspector

12:20AM | 12/07/02
Member Since: 09/27/02
73 lifetime posts
Jonathan,
well it sounds like you've covered all your bases here, yet the fixture is uncooperative.

i've had to chase down the manufacture's in many cases myself to be instructed as to specifics.

so if there are some instructions , it may behoove you to inquire as to exactly how these parts should be fitting together.

tec support, however, varies greatly in the manufacturing world, and this may or may not prove fruitful to you.

please post us back your results...

~curious...!

JonathanGennick

02:48AM | 12/07/02
Member Since: 11/02/02
69 lifetime posts
I'm not certain of the manufacturer. The instructions were pitiful, and I tossed both them and the box shortly after I roughed in the fixture. Probably I shouldn't have done that...

I really don't have lots of time to burn, so at this point I'm just going to give up on this fixture. There's just too much about it that bothers me. The glass in it isn't tempered either, so if it shatters I'll have glass shards all over the shower floor.

I'll use it as it is for now, but I'm going to try and find a better quality shower light fixture at some store other than ******* . Somebody surely must sell one of decent quality.

BTW, if anyone can point me to a light fixture rated for showers that's good, that I can buy over the Internet (I'm in a rather remote area), that'd be cool.

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