Latest Discussions : Miscellaneous

dadof5

07:22AM | 09/17/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
I moved into a house with a 20year old basment addition, I have an interior drain around the inside walls leading into a sump pit(its working) but I still get water leaks along one wall with heavy rains.

I think I need a french drain on the outside of the wall along the foundation but I am not sure how to go about building one. I'm pretty challenged when it come's to this stuff so the more detailed the directions, the better. Thanks in advance the help.

homebild

04:13PM | 09/17/04
Member Since: 01/28/03
693 lifetime posts
Installing a french drain around the exterior of the foundation is a very good but cost prohibitive idea.

Even for a modest sized home, the cost can easily exceed $20,000.

If you have that kind of money to spare and can recoup the investment by creating additional living space below ground and in your property value, then consider it.

Otherwise live with the water entering your basement.

cellarwater

11:16PM | 09/17/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
Yeah, big job. Pending on how deep this foundation is. This water that comes in. Does it come in only when it's raining? if so check the roof gutters, and the ground to make sure it is not ponding around the foundation wall. That might help a bit,to get rain water away from there.Try it out.C.

dadof5

05:15AM | 09/18/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
It only leaks with heavy rains, but it has leaked about 10 x in the past year and its a finished basement. I pulled some baseboards to find moldy rotting 2 x 4's behind the drywall. The gutters all drain to the front of the house and are working fine. The back yard slopes away from the house already and doesnt get swampy even when the water is leaking. As for the first response, thanks but I thought a french drain just involed digging a trench and laying a perf pipe. Except for the back breaking digging, where does the $20,000 price tag come from. What I dont know are things like, how far to dig,what kind of pipe, what and how much gravel, do I tar the walls before backfilling, etc.... We just got flooded again last night so Im mopping again. Thanks for the help but please keep the instructions coming.

cellarwater

04:42PM | 09/18/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
Sorry to read that you're under water again! Some peoples houses are getting washed away,right now! I feel bad for them. This hurricane season is devastating. O.K. quick drain lesson: 1st dig down to the footing,that is the level of the basement floor outside; 2nd put down 4inches 11/2 inch crushed stone 3rd lay 4inch swiss pipe 4th seal basement wall 5th pour the crushed rock right up to ground level.That's it. The pipe can go to the sump pump $20,000 is what a contractor will want for that job. I hope I have been of some help. C.

dadof5

05:19AM | 09/23/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
"C" thanks for the input, greatly appreciated. Sorry to keep bugging, when you say dig to the footing and fill with 4 inches of gravel, does that mean I actually dig 4 inches below the basement floor so that when I add the gravel the drain pipe will be at the same level as the floor?. Second I was going to use the 4inch black flexible tubes with the slit holes all around as the pipe, is this appropriate. Finally, what product do you recomend to put on the block wall to help waterproof? Thanks in advance for the help. Bob

cellarwater

09:34AM | 09/23/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
If you have a footing at the base of the wall dig along next to that. if the wall just stops, the floor of the trench will stop there also. Place the crushed rock along the wall 4 inches deep. Set the pipe holes down on that and fill with the crushed rock to the top. Use the straight white perforated pipe, the coiled stuff crushes easy, and it's difficult to hold a grade with it C.

dadof5

05:16PM | 09/29/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
hey c. thanks for the tips I'll let you know how many blisters it takes to dig a drain.!!

cellarwater

05:05PM | 09/30/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
Sure no problem. You're gonna have tough hands! One thing for safety. dig when the ground is dry. If you dig wet ground. Shore up the trench. It's a good idea wet or dry. People have lost their lives in cave ins. Good luck Have fun C.

dadof5

07:56AM | 10/13/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
Hey 'c' if your still out there, (or anyone else with some knowledge) While digging for the french drain, i dug about a foot below the level of the basement floor ( still not at the footer yet0 when out of a gap between 2 cinder block water came pouing out like a hose. as I continued to dig along the house at that level another gap sprouted. All in all I found 3 sprouting areas. the third a block lower than the first two. It took probably 5 hours before they were done draining. Any Idea? My plan is to leave the gaps open to drain and put the bottom of my french drain pipe at the level of the drain areas of the block. Am I thinking correct?

I plan on back filling with gravel tomorrow(Oct 14th) thanks again for your help. bob

tomh

08:06AM | 10/13/04
Member Since: 07/01/03
549 lifetime posts
Those gaps you uncovered were intentionally built into the wall to allow water to drain out of the wall to the drain. They must have been plugged by clay. As you proceed around the footer try to clean out any of these weep holes you can find. It is important that the backfill be washed drain rock so that they continue to function in the future. I think you found the root cause of your problem.

dadof5

11:06AM | 10/13/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
thanks tom I appreciate the input!

cellarwater

03:48PM | 10/14/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
Tom H. is right. fill everything up with stone. Leave the gaps open. Where is the drain going to end?? Where the pipe lets out the water must be lower than the floor in the cellar, in order for it to drain properly. Let me know what happens. C.

tomh

09:43PM | 10/14/04
Member Since: 07/01/03
549 lifetime posts
Good job pointing dadof5 to the solution of his problems. Obviously his exterior wall was all silted in sealing water in the basement and preventing proper drainage. It seems that proper backfill is so inexpensive compared to the damage and cost to go back and correct the easily prevented mistake. I really don't understand why general contractors allow their excavation subs to take this kind of shortcut.

cellarwater

01:59AM | 10/15/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
A little common sense goes a long way! C.

dadof5

05:30AM | 10/15/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
thanks to Tom and 'C'. I feel confident now that I'm on the right track. Just to update you guys (in case you have more good advise to add) I had to dig approx 2 feet below the level of the basement floor to get to the weep holes (and I still didnt hit the footer). Anyway of course, the rain has been back for 3 days here in the burg and my trench has been full of approx 8 inches of water stopping progress. My yard gets a river of run off from the street above and the leach bed at the end of the drain is full, but the water is still about 18 inches below the level of the basement floor and every thing has been dry so far. Can I assume Ive probably solved the problem. Due to the way my property is situated I cannot dig any lower or increase the size of the leach bed, the only other possibility is sumping the water uphill to the front street. I'm hoping you'll say its ok!!!! Ps

the area of the leach bed is approx 9 inches below the level of the basement floor and 6 inches lower than the highest end of the french drain. Much thanks again in advance

dadof5

05:32AM | 10/15/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
Also, I agree, if they are going to put weep holes in the block spend 50 dollars and put gravel and a pastic pipe down before you backfill. The soil here in the burg is almost entirely clay, which was what was backfilled against the weep hole. Even I know thats not too smart!

cellarwater

03:19PM | 10/15/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
Yes, go ahead and pipe the drain to the sump pump.Be careful about street pumping it. The water can freeze if you're in a cold climate [I'm in Mass.:)] and be a hazard for cars. If there is an actual field underground I suggest not to use it. You'll be pumping that water too. Best to let the sump pump drain to a low area away from the house. C.

dadof5

03:33PM | 10/17/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
Well, after 6 days of digging out and filling in, the french drain is complete, and except for a few blisters I've survived.Thanks for all the input and guidance. Believe it or not, we got some rain mid week after the trench was dug and sort or got in a hurry to lay the pipe and back fill with the gravel, I kind of forgot to tar the block beneath the level of the basement floor. Its backfilled with 6 ton of gravel that I dont want to remove,and I'm looking for some peace of mind that its ok. so just tell me not to worry everything will be all right and this will be my last response!!! Many thanks Bob

Piffin

04:23PM | 10/17/04
Member Since: 11/06/02
1278 lifetime posts
I see by the date, I might be a little late.

The $20K price sounded out of sight to me too for a FD, but I believe that the diff comes from a difference in use of terms.

By going down below your cellar floor, you are putting in a perimeter drain, which some call a french drain.

But most places where I have worked, a french drain is more of a surface system to catch surface runoff, and guide it away from the house before it has time to seep and penetrate deeper into the soil where it can find a way to leak into the foundation.

What you are doing is the better way, giving a drain so water ahs a way to flow away from the house first. The best of dams will leak if you do not give the water another place to go.

The water has been getting into the block wall and slowly seeping thru to the interior, which is why some block sections werre filled with water until you provide ( by digging) a better place to go than inside.

So run that drainage to daylight or to a drywell, and the waterproof the foundation wall again and 99.99% should stay out.

Excellence is its own reward!


dadof5

05:37AM | 10/25/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
'c' tom or piffin or any other expert. With all your help I dug and dug and dug and put in a foundation drain backfilled entirely with limestone and it drains downhill to daylight(following your instructions and advise from the past 18 replies. As stated in my hurry to beat a pending rainfall, I forgot to tar the block before I backfilled,

My latest question is, since I didnt tar the outside and I have to re-do the inside dry wall I want to waterproof the inside. I found a web site www.sanitred.com that sells

waterproofing product that have some fantastic claims. I was interested in the "permaflex" and "LRB". I just wanted to know If you guys ever heard of this stuff and what you think or if you havent could you take a look and tell me what you think.

Continued thanks for your help and advise

Bob

tk100gct

03:32PM | 11/01/04
Member Since: 10/31/04
3 lifetime posts
I am a newbee

Just found this forum on a search about footing/perimeter drains

I have had some similar trouble, except that my c-blocks turned to sand and collapsed.

i just finnished pouring a new wall

and i was searching for details on installing the drains.

anyway in reading the threads to this forum, i believe someone advised you to put the "holes" on the straight white perforated pipe "down".

i just wanted to correct them, and say that they should be "up" until the pipe decends at least 10 ft from the foundation.

Also, i am running mine to daylight too, but if someone isn't able to do that, there are some other great options like:

the infiltrator at www.infiltratorsystems.com

and

flow-well leaching systems at www.ndspro.com


tk100gct

03:40PM | 11/01/04
Member Since: 10/31/04
3 lifetime posts
oh yea

how could i forget

i found this stuff recently

i haven't used it yet

but i hear its great

i will probably install it in the spring, around my perimeter

www.americanwick.com

good luck!

cellarwater

07:33PM | 11/03/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
Those holes drilled in that pipe want to be down with a minimum of 4 inches of crushed rock below the holes. There will be an extra 4 and 1/2 extra inches of water height in the ground with the holes turned up. C.

Glenn Good

03:18PM | 11/04/04
Member Since: 09/10/03
314 lifetime posts
cellarwater is correct. The holes in the pipe should always face DOWN. The water in the trench will have to fill up to a level with the holes before it can spill into them.

Water draining into the trench is not going to run directly into the holes in the pipe. The water only enters the pipe when the water level in the bottom of the trench reaches the elevation of the holes. If the holes are turned up the water level must build to a higher level before it can reach them.

The pipe carrying the water away from the foundation should not have holes at all. It should be soild.

Glenn

Moderator: Construction Systems, Foundations, and Masonry & Stone

For more information about me and/or my qualifications please visit my website at:

www.consultationdirect.com

dadof5

04:26PM | 11/04/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
Thanks all for the input. Dont worry I put the holes down and so far seems to be working fine, though I need a good 2inch rain to be sure.Im still wondering if anyone has heard of the waterproofing products offered on www.sanitred.com. As stated, believe it or not I forgot to tar the outside block before backfilling, so for peace of mind I want to waterproof the inside of the wall before I replace the warped water damaged drywall and frame inside.Would appreciate any input on these products if you have heard of them or what you think of the claims on the website. It very expensive per gallon and would hate to waste the money, but would be worth it if it lives up to its claims.(And is safe) Many thanks again. Bob F.

cellarwater

04:49PM | 11/05/04
Member Since: 12/09/03
175 lifetime posts
I wish I had more info on Sanitred I don't. I hope the drain works well though! That was an [pardon the pun:)] UNDERtaking. I would favor sealing the wall from the outside. C.

dadof5

09:25AM | 11/10/04
Member Since: 09/16/04
16 lifetime posts
The job is complete inside and out. Many thanks to all who responded with helpful advise. On a rainy night, if you hear a loud cry coming from the Pittsburgh area, it will be me !!!! thanks again, bob f

Glenn Good

04:48PM | 11/10/04
Member Since: 09/10/03
314 lifetime posts
Glad you got your project done. Good luck and I hope all goes well.

GO STEELERS!

Glenn

Moderator: Construction Systems, Foundations, and Masonry & Stone

For more information about me and/or my qualifications please visit my website at:

www.consultationdirect.com

sugarbaker

06:15AM | 03/13/10
Member Since: 03/12/10
1 lifetime posts
We dug a basement under an addition and ran into an underground stream. We live beside a stream - don't ask me why we didn't cover up the hole and start over. But to make a long story short, we built block walls and had to pump water continuously till it was done. The minute we shut off the pump, the basement got up to a foot of water in it. It was the talk of the neighborhood. I found Sanitred on the internet and decided to go for it. It cost a lot, but we had to do something. We did put a sump pump outside the basement wall at the bottom and that wasn't enough. So I put layer after layer of Sanitred inside the walls, being very careful to follow the directions. Everytime it rained alot and a small leak came through the block I circled it with marker and when the water went down, plugged the hole with Sanitred stuff. I had to do the same thing with the floor, because the concrete would develop a small crack. I worked over a year and was thoroughly impressed with Sanitred. Finally once and for all, I bought a lot of the Tav/LRB and used it to lay tile over the whole floor. The basement is 15' x 30'. Like I said, it was expensive, but without it we would have been "sunk"! By the way, we put another pump down at the other one and are using the water for the house. The sump pump runs continuously besides. I believe in this stuff!!


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