Latest Discussions : Miscellaneous

DIYer2

09:15AM | 04/25/06
Member Since: 04/24/06
3 lifetime posts
Hello everyone. Hoping to get some helpful ideas on what we can do.

We have an empty basement (about 1100 sq. feet) that is completely covered with VA Tile, or so we believe. Last week, the entire basement flooded nearly a foot....this is probably the 3rd time that it has happened.

The tiles are a mess...many are sliding off, as the mastic no longer sticks...some have buckled and broken, and some are simply stuck like nothing ever happened.

We began removing them, using as garden hose to keep the floor soaked as we try to pry them up. Most of them break, but not crumble.

After we finish, we would like to paint the entire floor, as we can't see the point in re-tiling or carpeting the floor, when every few years we have another major rainwater sewer backup.

Do we have to remove the black mastic underneath in order to paint? It is not sticky, AT ALL, and it is as solid as can be. Scraping does NOTHING to remove this stuff! I've thought about renting a power washer and trying that, but haven't done so yet.

Can anyone recommend a good sealer for over the mastic? Is it possible to seal then paint over it? If so, what do I use?

By the way, we are selling the house this summer, and are trying to complete this project by investing as little as possible (the other reason we don't want to replace the tile with new tile!).

Any ideas?

tomh

09:08PM | 06/01/06
Member Since: 07/01/03
549 lifetime posts
A power washer won't touch this. There are commercial solvents that are used to chemically soften and remove floor mastic. You can find them by doing an internet search. Note that there are volatile compounds that require a lot of ventilation, and can pose a fire and health hazard, and citrus, low volatility solvents that are considerably safer, but still have a distinctive odor. You can order this stuff even though you are not a contractor. Buy a full length floor scraper at the home improvement or hardware store, use a solvent and ventilation; and you can remove the problem.

Painting over any mastic is not recommended. It is very hard to seal, and will bleed dark color through the paint, and is usually an adhesion problem.

DIYer2

09:43AM | 06/07/06
Member Since: 04/24/06
3 lifetime posts
Thanks for your advice!

Obviously, I posted this some time ago, so I thought I'd just update this.

We found a "safe" product called Bean-e-doo made by FranMar Chemical. This stuff is amazing when it comes to black mastic. It is soybean based, and has no odor...it is like cooking oil. Pour some onto the floor, spread it around with a broom, wait about 1 hour, and the black mastic turns into liquid. Squeegee into a pile, use oil dry to pick it up, and scrub the floor with a degreaser. We were amazed at the results.

Our floor is nearly spotless and ready for the next step! Beanedoo was like a magic potion. I highly recommmend it for stubborn black mastic!

tomh

07:27AM | 06/13/06
Member Since: 07/01/03
549 lifetime posts
I'm glad you followed up. We do get a lot of questions on mastic removal, and a homeowner using a non-toxic and effective product with success is very good feedback. I'll probably refer to your Bean e doo experience in the future.

Thanks

Tom

KingVolcano

12:27PM | 07/27/06
Member Since: 03/03/05
273 lifetime posts
I have also used this soy based solvent with success on mastic and some epoxies. However, this product will not remove the mastic from the pores of the cement. If you plan on applying anything onto the floor, you must restore the pores to a proper profile to accept the new coating.

bvilla

12:24PM | 10/31/06
Member Since: 10/30/06
4 lifetime posts
I have seen other mastic removers that are petroleum based at www.Twin-Chemicals.com they are stronger and less expensive, but they have a lower flash point, which doesn't really matter anyway.

brianhunter01

07:45AM | 04/17/07
Member Since: 04/16/07
1 lifetime posts
I removed floor tile in my basment a year ago and below it was this stinky black mastic. I ended up covering it with carpeting. I have read all this stuff and found out that it probably contains abstesos as well. Is this something I should worry about or am I fine because it is covered with carpeting. The stuff is so dam sticky and glued down that I could not imagin anything airborning from it. Also did they use abstesos in plaster in 1952? I have grinded that stuff up to putting in light boxes

joejay

07:09PM | 05/15/07
Member Since: 05/09/07
3 lifetime posts
It is not safe to scrape the tile or glue.

joejay

07:17PM | 05/15/07
Member Since: 05/09/07
3 lifetime posts
When you use the Bean-e-do to remove the mastic it is dangerous when you dispose it. Is there a safe way.

Burlis

11:40PM | 06/16/08
Member Since: 06/08/08
1 lifetime posts
So, what is the "next step" after all this mastic is up?.. since nothing on earth can be applied over it to seal it for painting or leveled over it to make a new concrete surface?

Seriously, what do the abatement guys do? Just get all the tile up and mastic down to a thin stain then just pack up and leave you with no options?

Can the surface not be sealed with a resin/epoxy/cement compound etc?

Tarkenton

10:37AM | 01/19/09
Member Since: 01/18/09
1 lifetime posts
I found Sentinel Products online

www.senpro.com and they manufacture a line of mastic removers, including a soy based product. When the mastic has been liquefied you can absorb up the liquid with kitty litter or sawdust and throw it away. You then use a tsp cleaner to wash away any remaining residue. Give your floor a day or two to dry out and it will be ready for sealing or new flooring installation.

primotack

11:54AM | 08/12/10
Member Since: 08/11/10
1 lifetime posts
OK. I just removed 1000 square feet on asbestos tile and mastic from the bottom 2 floors on the house we just bought in may. I used the Bean-e-doo product but now I have 3 five gallon buckets full of what looks like kitty litter soaked in used motor oil. The tiles were able to be disposed of at the local dump but the buckets I'm not 100% sure what to do with. They are sealed and taped.

The project though was back breaking, time consuming and HOT. The tyvek suits, gloves, rubber boots and respirator were required and the entire area walls and ceiling were covered in 6 mil plastic. The ground was sprayed down with a hose and a little detergent to keep the dust from tile removal to a minimum.

After the tile was out I bagged the in 9mil bags and took them on a truck to the dump while the ground dried. Then I came back and applied the bean-e-doo.

Some notes on that product. Let it sit at least 1 hour. Get a proper floor squeege to help you bring the pool to the center of the room and absorb it with kitty litter or an industtrial absorbant. Make sure not to lay the bean-e-doo down to thick otherwise that area will remain stuck to the floor when you squeege. Also try to let the floor dry before using. Some spots might require a 2nd coat to properly loosen.

After everything was up I mopped and mopped and mopped with a degreeser solution. Usually went through about 2-3 mopheads per area. They wet mop after that with just plain water.

That product didn't havenoticable fume and is supposed to be ok to use in populated building but I didn't take chances and at that stage made sure to get some fresh air into the room.

Hope this was helpful.

jackdtg

10:57AM | 11/21/10
Member Since: 11/20/10
2 lifetime posts
I want to have the concrete surface ready to accept the mortar for ceramic tiles.

Do I need to do anything else, or am I good to go after the Bean-e-doo?

BV001564

08:25AM | 07/15/13
bean e doo was a nightmare for me. Pay someone to skim coat it. The bean e doo re activates the mastic, so if you dont get every little bit of it youll regret it because it will stay tacky. I wish someone would have told me about skim coating in the begining. I can't tell you enough how messy bean e do is. It gets on everything, ruins 100 mops. If they really layed the cut back on thick your gonna need 100's of dollars of bean e doo. I payed a guy 300 bucks to do a 900sqft basement. Its dry now so all i have to do is slap some paint on. After the bean e doo mess i would have probably payed double just to make the nightmare go away.

BV002366

01:16AM | 10/21/13
"Pay someone to skim coat it. The bean e doo re activates the mastic, so if you dont get every little bit of it youll regret it because it will stay tacky. I wish someone would have told me about skim coating in the begining."

What do you mean "skim coat" it ... what is that? What product do you specifically use? I really don't want to be scraping this up - not sure if it has asbestos in it but now I'm concerned it does. Would really just love to put something over top of it so that I can paint it! Help please!

BV002575

02:49PM | 11/16/13
What if I like the look of the black mastic? Does anyone know of a way to cover it with clear coating so I can keep the look?

BV002608

02:26AM | 11/20/13
same thing here, bean e doo made a huge mess and now I just have a sticky black floor with no hope in sight. It really wont cut all the way through the mastic, it just softened it into a sticky mess. blech!

BV002733

09:15PM | 12/06/13
We have tile in our basement, that to the best I can determine is asphalt, not asbestos. Some of the tile was removed by the crew we had put in French drains, to eliminate a dampness issue due to a high water table. Underneath the tile are streaks of a dark adhesive. It was suggested (by a flooring specialist) that the tile may have been glued down with black mastic, due to the age of our home (1965). However, the substance isn't sticky like other posters are describing. Does this mean it's not black mastic?

Our end goal is to install a modular floor. Because of previous dampness issues, we want to install something that can be easily taken up and dried out, on the off chance the drains don't work. Is it OK to install a modular floor on top of these adhesive remains if they are black mastic? Or, is the breath-ability of this flooring, that we want because of the previous dampness issues, contraindicated because of the potential of asbestos? Is there an alternate way to level out the floor, where tile was removed by our contractors, so that we don't inadvertently disturb (any more) asbestos?

BV003525

01:08AM | 03/13/14
Working on removing black mastic which once (likely) held down vinyl tiles which were common in this neighborhood (probably asbestos). Using Klean Strip and a floor scraper. Some areas come nearly clean, many are still dark and tacky. Quite a mess to deal with.
Looking to apply a brown paper floor technique so not sure if I need to get ALL the mastic up or I can simply scrape away it's raised texture and be good with the remaining black tackiness???
Thinking of trying to seal the surface after a full scraping in order to make a unified adhesive surface for the brown paper application.
Not sure what anyone may know about this . . .
Img 3298

BV008005

04:32PM | 06/06/15
We just used the product, Bean-e-Doo from Franmar, works awesome! You must degrease it after you soak up all the mastic liquid. If you don't, you may find yourself with a sticky residue as one comment read.

Glad I found this post, we were about to grind the floors with a sander.... saved us some time.

- dp

BV008302

04:12PM | 07/09/15
I used the Soy based product MA-99 from Mast-Away. Ordered online at masticremover.com . I did have some questions on how to use it and called the number on the website and Robert was so helpful.

BV009066

06:12PM | 09/28/15
• Your first step is to encapsulate the area and create a skim-coated bond surface. The easiest way to achieve this is to start with FlexBond Thin-Set Mortar
• and coat a thin skim-coat on the cutback. FlexBond is an aggressive adhesive and will grab onto the cutback to ensure the next steps hold up properly over time.
• Once that has set, you'll need to prep this new surface with a bonding primer. This will help your next layer adhere to it properly and set it up as a wear layer. Use the LevelQuik Latex Primer on your FlexBond substrate and allow it to dry to a clear film before proceeding.
• Next, use a bag of LevelQuikRS Rapid-Setting Self-Leveling Underlayment to set up a new wear layer. This product will dry like a concrete surface once set and will be your new subfloor.
• For proper use of this product, you must use an epoxy paint as the top coat. Most epoxy paints will recommend an etching of the concrete wear layer prior to use, however bypass this step as you will ruin the work you just put into it. Proceed with the manufacturer instructions for your paint and you will have a new walkable, painted surface!~

BV009534

04:34PM | 11/16/15
I used Bean-e-doo and it took all the mastic off. It was really easy, but now I think the Bean-e-doo is in the pores of the concrete. I took a 14" floor machine and scrubbed the floor TWICE with the Fenmar degreaser that is recommended for cleaning up the bean-e-doo. Once with a scrub-brush type of attachment and the second time with the green scrubbing pad, but anything I put on the floor turns into a greasy tacky mess even though the floor seems like it is cleaned off. It also fails the water test. Water does not penetrate the floor at all. It just sits on top which means that nothing will adhere to it, and I will either have to skim coat the floor or have it ground if I want to put a coating on it. I ended up putting carpet on it instead of painting the floor. I want to remove more mastic in my house (it is a different type than the other mastic I removed). Maybe the bean-e-doo isn't the problem and I should give it another chance?

BV009548

08:16AM | 11/18/15
Wow, great floor article.Really thank you! Keep writing.

BV009643

06:36PM | 11/30/15
I do NOT recommend Bean-e-doo:
I tried it (1 gal ~46 sq ft) and now what is not still covered in newly re-activated, sticky black mastic is covered in greasy, water beading residue after multiple scrubbings with degreaser. Hours and hours have been spent on degreasing attempts. Yes, it dissolved SOME of the mastic, but it appears to have left most of it after multiple applications/cleanings. And what did dissolve flowed under walls where the Oil-dry can't reach and is impossible to degrease, leaving still contaminated mastic lurking for the next time things are torn up. All that time and $$ wasted as I will have to hope to encapsulate it anyway but now I have residual releasing agent issues especially near walls too!

[Further, I wet-dry vacuumed off degreaser/water (after scooping up Oil-dry) and now I'm guessing my vac is probably coated with a fine asbestos layer along its entire air path?]

BV009645

07:56PM | 11/30/15
Humm, I recently cleaned an outside patio golden mastic using the klean-strip adhesive remover. Took two coats, one to get close to the concrete, and then another coat to get close to the the concrete. $25 per can, it adds up. It can can cover two contractor bags 10x10 twice. After covering the area, a tarp or plastic bag was positioned over to keep the air out and the evaporation low. I used it in 65 degree and 45 degree temps, not much of a difference. I think humidity makes a difference. I used a 4 inch scraper for better control and a hammer. I also used a Dewalt DW4772t grinder to take it all the way down and level the concrete. The grinder can make the mastic gummy and ineffective, ya have to get the mastic pretty low to the concrete for the grinder to work.

BV011975

08:32AM | 06/17/16
The only thing I've found truly effective for getting up black mastic is, unfortunately, mineral spirits.

Rented a floor buffer with heavy duty scrub pads to churn it up, then used a large floor squeegee to push the liquid into a mass on a cardbord, transfer to dump in 5gal buckets.

The rest came quite clean by hand scrubbing with a nylon scrubber & mineral spirits and wiping up with old cotton rags.

But do NOT put any of the materials used in your regular trash!
Glad toxic waste disposal is coming up soon in my town!

Bottom line is - proper removal for a truly clean surface is time consuming and expensive.

mmarse1

07:57PM | 03/13/18
Member Since: 03/13/18
1 lifetime posts
I have applied Bean e doo to my concrete floor to remove a heavy layer of black mastic. I does take off the mastic and is a messy job. I will use as de greasing agents to remove the product that
remains. However, i believe the product is now embedded in the pores of the concrete. I want to paint over it but I afraid of
turning a difficult project into even more of a problem.
DOES ANY ONE OUT THERE HAVE A PROVEN SOLUTION FOR ADDRESSING THIS PROBLEM.
I was told by a local floor covering store that they use a special German made glue for installing their indoor- outdoor carpeting when covering floors with black mastic. I strongly
perfer findind a solution where i can paint over the surface and KNOW THAT IT WILL ADHERE. I'M open to all possibly solutions.

BV015930

12:55AM | 03/16/18
You can grind it off with tricks of the trade.

You will need a high quality floor grinder with a HEPA vacuum. Equip the grinder with PCD tooling. Aramsco (USA) and Safety Express (CAN) rent equipment designed for asbestos cantaminated material.

To prevent the mastic from rolling and sticking to the diamonds. Spread a dust like encapsulant onto the surface. Concrete dust and flour work well. For larger areas spread a layer across the floor using a foam squeegee to prevent airborne dust. Use a roller to pulverize it into the surface. If you can walk on the mastic and it's not sticky, start your grinder. Take it slow. 550 rpm. Use a 25-50% overlap on your passes. It will come off. Use the PCDs to get off 75% of the mastic and then switch to a 30/40 grit diamond. Finish off with a thorough mopping and your floor will be beautifully prepped for new coverings.

You're Welcome.

BV018514

11:12PM | 01/26/19
I have found that using slow steady rocking side to side pressure with a heavy enough sharpened blade, such as ax blade or very sharp heavy duty scraper , while advancing forward with pressure at the same time , gets most blast mastic off.. not chopping but a steady pushing movement. The weight of the ax behind the pressure really helps. It’s very hard work but after enough practice one gets faster at it.
Chopping is bad and fast movement is bad when it comes to there being possible asbestos in there. GO Slowly , bit by bit not large areas at once. The slow and steady wins the race saying definitely applies with this type of job. This does leave some marks but after it is all off and the area is wiped down with towels ( paper ) and any residue ( not stuck down residue but broken off pieces ) collected with water and some soap is rolled up in the towels and disposed of, there is no need for sanding and you could even sand by hand if you need to. Sanding by hand causes much less upset and doesn’t throw the dust like a power sander does. Sand paper can be moved slowly to the bucket because it has the dust in it , and new used over and over. Use a mask on face keep mouth closed while working etc .
Keep your knees your feet your arms up off of the surface as much as possible while you work and if you move from the area leave your work clothes and shoes behind so that dust or any little bits don’t get tracked through the house. Do not work with blowing heat ducts or fans, AC ON THE AREA... basically just don’t disturb any area that has just been worked upon.. then continue to work on the next spot .. work in a clean manner so that you can maintain a safe job. After it’s all gone do a very good SLOW sweep with a hand broom and dust pan,, again move that slowly into a bucket that’s getting thrown away and put wet paper towels on top.. then use a vacuum to suck up the entire area and get your stain and poly over it. This will seal in anything left behind. There is ALWAYS A RISK AND Always hard work involved with jobs like this .. the only other option I know is to take up the entire floor and put down new or cover over with new carpet or new flooring and don’t touch the old.


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